That is incredibly strange, but I suppose it was inevitable with the situation we're in. Mr. Talis must be beside himself.
Oh. Thank you, that was very considerate. I was thinking of doing so myself, so you've saved me a substantial expense. Though please do keep in mind that you personally can't make use of one for another few months.
I trust nothing dire occurred...?
[ Or he'd have gotten an alert, is what he means. Even on Auriel Harold hadn't totally left his technology behind. He takes his agreement to monitor Accelerator extremely seriously, and configured his custom-built secondary device to alert him if his brain reading parameters exceeded certain thresholds. ]
From what I've seen he seems to be handling it alright. He and mecha-Viktor don't seem to get along, but they aren't at each other's throats.
[In Accelerator's mind, that means there are no problems.]
I'll keep that in mind.
[That is especially relevant given Sleipnir.... But he also has his esper ability right now, so he isn't in any danger.
... Even if just thinking about Auriel scares him a little....]
He did it to 'kill' me for that fucking game. I'm still pissed off about it.
[Which is an understatement about how he feels. It's like he's been thrown off-balance, and the only thing that will fix that is listening to the voice in his head that is screaming at him to get Sleipnir back.]
Must we call him that? I really do wish he had a surname -- either incarnation. Regardless, it must be distressing to encounter... I'm a bit tempted to check in on Mr. Talis, despite us finding ourselves at loggerheads in the past.
I see. I don't believe that had any consequences beyond taking you out of the game itself, did it? If that's the case then I assume he was asserting his sense of power to counteract his own vulnerability and trauma. But he did abide by the agreement.
That isn't a bad idea. Talis would probably appreciate that you give a shit.
Are you serious? He was fucking with me. That bastard was smug the entire time because he knew I couldn't do anything without blowing my cover! If that hadn't been an issue I would have put him through a wall.
Very well, I'll consider that encouragement, then.
Indulge me a moment in considering what your own actions would likely be in his position, assuming you were experiencing the same emotional fallout as you are right now.
No! I've been trying to fucking leave him alone. And if I didn't I wouldn't bother fucking with him at all, I'd just beat the shit out of him. That would improve my mood a hell of a lot.
[ That is the exact word he told John to use for their own relationship. ]
And I appreciate your restraint immensely. If he is barred from physical altercation with you, however, he may find some solace in more juvenile tactics. Suffice to say, I have no reason to believe Sleipnir is any less emotionally impacted than you have been, which may result in some hasty and unwise actions.
Though I admit I am no expert in post-death coping mechanisms.
Do I need to spell it out? Especially to you, of all people?
[He's thinking the exact same thing.]
If he's feeling the same way I am then he should be exercising the same control I've been doing. If he can't do that, then why should I? Now that we're back from the mission there's nothing stopping me from approaching the bastard to talk to him.
[... Well, he isn't entirely sure that it's talking he would be doing, but he'll figure that out when he gets there.]
That demonstrates a surprisingly limited imagination on your part.
[ Like this is the first time someone's implicitly assumed he and John are sleeping together. Harold is unruffled. And really, he doesn't know why everyone just immediately leaps to assuming people are having sex, like there's no other way to demonstrate deep affection.
But then he grows completely serious. Because Harold already uses completely correct spelling and punctuation over text, he has to demonstrate this by using his horrible experiment name. ]
Accelerator. I personally despise Sleipnir for what he's done to you, and the remarkable cruelty he's shown in how he's done it. But he is not, to my knowledge, fundamentally any different than you.
If I forgive your cruelty then I must forgive his. And so should you.
[ It's not lost on Harold that if Accelerator is unable to forgive himself, he would be unable to forgive others for the same crimes, but he doesn't quite dare to approach that in writing -- just leaves it as implied as the nature of his and John's relationship. ]
[It seems cut and dry to him. Even if he personally feels like he's never experienced this kind of physical attraction or attachment before, he's well aware that it's normal for other people (especially adults) to.
Still, it's a complicated subject, as is Sleipnir. Seeing this is one of those rare occasions where Harold is using his name makes him instantly more attentive and nervous.]
No.
[That reaction is coming reflexively. There is no way in hell he could forgive Sleipnir. Take responsibility for his own actions? Sure, he's learned how to do that thanks to the clones and Last Order. But beyond that? Absolutely not.]
I'm not a good person like you are. I'm not capable of that.
Edited (Oops more came to me.) 2025-12-31 23:55 (UTC)
I mean that physical intimacy is only one method of closeness, and it can be more or less important for each person.
[ Himself included, but he's keeping this abstract, especially since he has no idea where Accelerator's own feelings on the subject lie. Somehow they've gotten into two heavy conversations at once about two totally different things... but they're both important enough that Harold won't drop one for the other.
The reflexive refusal disappoints him, makes his throat feel tight. Harold doesn't know what he's doing here, not really, doesn't know where he's found the gall to think he could help mentor a young person through topics as difficult as this--
But then another comment comes. Harold types carefully: ] Forgiveness is not a feeling but an act. One you've already shown yourself capable of.
That's the case for most people, though. [They aren't talking about most people, though, are they? All four of them aren't exactly the pinnacle of normal for different reasons.] It isn't for you and Reese?
[Admittedly, he's a little more curious about Harold and John's relationship status than he is Jayce and Viktor. He's closer to them, and for crying out loud, they were fake-married on Earth-2. There has to be something there, even if he isn't sure what it is.
Besides that, there are his own feelings about himself. He doesn't think Harold is correct, he's just thinking the best of him. It hurts, not being able to live up to his expectations.]
Mr. Reese has not indicated to me he wants that kind of relationship, so no. And I wouldn't assume it to be the case of anyone without confirmation.
[ Harold is very much the sort of person who thinks consent should be explicit and enthusiastic. Only yes means yes. And though it's vanishingly rare for Harold to speak frankly about this, he thinks Accelerator is owed some clarity on who he and John are to each other. It's a natural thing to wonder about if he's going to be living with them, unspoken arrangement or not. ]
No, I meant that you encountered him on Auriel, endured him taunting you and metaphorically "killing" you again, and restrained yourself. If forgiveness is an action then you're doing it already.
[He isn't sure what that says about him that he was making that assumption in particular. He'd like to chalk to up to the society he was raised in without any further reflection. That's a hell of a lot easier than the alternative.]
I wasn't doing that out of any sense of fucking kindness towards him. It was a necessity for the mission. I was being pragmatic.
[And it had been a huge struggle the entire time. Part of himself still hates that he refrained from doing anything.]
[ Thankfully, Accelerator wasn't crass in response, which means he gets to keep the hard-earned privilege of Harold being forthright about his personal relationships with him. ]
It doesn't lessen our relationship in my mind any, in case that has to be said. I've never been overly concerned with ascribing to social conventions.
Intent and outcome are wholly, mercifully separate. [ Then he has to stop and struggle with himself over what to type next, because Harold has a huge spinning array of thoughts on this topic, and he needs to distill them down rather than just go off on a lecture about one of his favorite ethical dilemmas. ]
I can't measure what you might have done or why you did it, only what you did do. It was a foundational premise to how I built the Machine. And it was vital to prevent it from being used as a tool for abuse.
[It's a miracle Accelerator isn't being as vulgar as he could be. The line between vulgarity and straightforwardness can be a thin one, and he's trying to make an effort to balance it. Somewhat.
Anyways, this conversation is making it very clear that he doesn't actually know what Harold and John's relationship is. They're partners, but if one removes the physical component from that description, and take Harold's lack of interest in social conventions into account, what's left is... very vague and ambiguous.
Since they're talking about, he thinks he may as well ask. They're already starting to clear the air, there isn't any reason to stop now.]
Then what the hell are you two?
[It is, at least, a lot easier to ask that than tackle the rest of Harold's texts. This is far from the first time Harold has compared him to the Machine, and it makes him wonder what she would do if she was in this position. Which, ironically, she may have been? He doesn't know the details of her creation, but Harold has told him a few key things in the past.]
Didn't she try to kill you a bunch of times?
[He knows that whole situation must have been complicated, but he has to ask anyways.]
[ Harold can handle others being straightforward even if he himself usually isn't -- but being vulgar about his loved ones crosses a line that makes him clam up, so it's effort well-spent. ]
I've never been troubled by the need to find a label for it. We care for one another very much.
[ There's Harold's lack of concern for social convention coming into play again. His deep appreciation of the complexity of humanity, of emotions and of morals, means he doesn't feel compelled to define things too closely. The ambiguity is where reality sits. ]
Yes, sometimes for credible reasons. I could and did terminate the Machine multiple times. It was not illogical for it to see me as a threat.
But that isn't what I was getting at. If you, like the Machine, could predict behavior to varying degrees of accuracy, what threshold would you pick for when to intervene? How confident do you need to be in your prediction to treat someone as a criminal? I had and continued to have the capacity to terminate her existence. Why did she cease seeing me as a threat?
[It's kind of crazy to hear that. Yes, Harold is sentimental and more in touch with his emotions than he is, but he's still a logical person. You don't build the first goddamn sentient AI without having the kind of mindset that lends itself to analyzing, categorizing, formulating clear answers. And this is not that.]
That depends on what lens I'm using to judge someone with. Back home it's easy, since I'm the head of the city it's my responsibility to make sure people have the freedom and privacy to make their own choices, and when those choices are counter to fair laws I'm the one who makes sure they're prosecuted and rehabilitated in a way that allows them to learn from their mistakes and become productive members of society, and not fall through the fucking cracks.
[It's a burden, but it also provides him with a certain amount of structure and a clear direction.]
In Etraya I don't have that responsibility. It doesn't even fucking matter that I'm the #1. We don't even have a legal system to act as a yardstick for what's considered criminal, so all I have to go off of are my own experiences and emotions.
[Which is intensely frustrating! He doesn't like his emotions, he hates that they exist and he refuses to engage with them on any meaningful level as much as possible.]
Why should I? John hasn't asked for it or seemed dissatisfied with the way things are, and I'm not about to for anyone else's sake.
[ Harold really, truly, genuinely could not care less what other people think of his relationships. Words are communication tools, not limiters on reality. If the person in question needs more communication, he will oblige, but if there's no need for it then he doesn't see the point for its own sake. Limitations are so often just society-approved illusions.
Then he reads over the rest of this message closely, taking it in. Accelerator is usually quite terse, so he takes this as a sign that this topic touches him acutely. ]
Enforcing an established legal system is a reasonable fallback when you've just been thrust into a position of immense authority, so don't take this comment as a criticism. But as with the Machine, laws will not be adequate for who you are or who you might become. You must form your own judgment.
I'm liable to talk in circles on this concept, as it weighed on me heavily for many years, so I'll cut to the chase. Things you have almost done don't count on the moral scale. Things you might do don't count. Things you are capable of, thoughts you've had, even your feelings -- they can't ever be measured. It's like solving an equation without defining a key constant. That undefined constant remains, a ghost weighing over you casting doubt on your conclusions.
The only certainty you can have is through judging by actions alone. And I am proud of your actions.
![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
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I can certainly do my best at advocating for logic. What is the other stuff?
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I got you and Reese death passes.
[That's the easy one. There's a beat as he tries to type out the next thing a few times.]
Sleipnir approached me when we were in Auriel.
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Oh. Thank you, that was very considerate. I was thinking of doing so myself, so you've saved me a substantial expense. Though please do keep in mind that you personally can't make use of one for another few months.
I trust nothing dire occurred...?
[ Or he'd have gotten an alert, is what he means. Even on Auriel Harold hadn't totally left his technology behind. He takes his agreement to monitor Accelerator extremely seriously, and configured his custom-built secondary device to alert him if his brain reading parameters exceeded certain thresholds. ]
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[In Accelerator's mind, that means there are no problems.]
I'll keep that in mind.
[That is especially relevant given Sleipnir.... But he also has his esper ability right now, so he isn't in any danger.
... Even if just thinking about Auriel scares him a little....]
He did it to 'kill' me for that fucking game. I'm still pissed off about it.
[Which is an understatement about how he feels. It's like he's been thrown off-balance, and the only thing that will fix that is listening to the voice in his head that is screaming at him to get Sleipnir back.]
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I see. I don't believe that had any consequences beyond taking you out of the game itself, did it? If that's the case then I assume he was asserting his sense of power to counteract his own vulnerability and trauma. But he did abide by the agreement.
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That isn't a bad idea. Talis would probably appreciate that you give a shit.
Are you serious? He was fucking with me. That bastard was smug the entire time because he knew I couldn't do anything without blowing my cover! If that hadn't been an issue I would have put him through a wall.
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Very well, I'll consider that encouragement, then.
Indulge me a moment in considering what your own actions would likely be in his position, assuming you were experiencing the same emotional fallout as you are right now.
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I wouldn't be fucking with him using a goddamn flower. I can tell you that much.
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No? If you were precluded from taking action by your liege-lord, you would just be "fucking with him" in other ways, perhaps?
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No! I've been trying to fucking leave him alone. And if I didn't I wouldn't bother fucking with him at all, I'd just beat the shit out of him. That would improve my mood a hell of a lot.
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[ That is the exact word he told John to use for their own relationship. ]
And I appreciate your restraint immensely. If he is barred from physical altercation with you, however, he may find some solace in more juvenile tactics. Suffice to say, I have no reason to believe Sleipnir is any less emotionally impacted than you have been, which may result in some hasty and unwise actions.
Though I admit I am no expert in post-death coping mechanisms.
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[He's thinking the exact same thing.]
If he's feeling the same way I am then he should be exercising the same control I've been doing. If he can't do that, then why should I? Now that we're back from the mission there's nothing stopping me from approaching the bastard to talk to him.
[... Well, he isn't entirely sure that it's talking he would be doing, but he'll figure that out when he gets there.]
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If only the poor behavior of others was excuse enough for us to follow suit. Sadly, we must still be held responsible for our actions.
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I assume they're fucking.
I'm fine with that. I've done enough horrible shit in my life that accepting responsibility is easy for me. What's one more thing added to the pile?
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[ Like this is the first time someone's implicitly assumed he and John are sleeping together. Harold is unruffled. And really, he doesn't know why everyone just immediately leaps to assuming people are having sex, like there's no other way to demonstrate deep affection.
But then he grows completely serious. Because Harold already uses completely correct spelling and punctuation over text, he has to demonstrate this by using his horrible experiment name. ]
Accelerator. I personally despise Sleipnir for what he's done to you, and the remarkable cruelty he's shown in how he's done it. But he is not, to my knowledge, fundamentally any different than you.
If I forgive your cruelty then I must forgive his. And so should you.
[ It's not lost on Harold that if Accelerator is unable to forgive himself, he would be unable to forgive others for the same crimes, but he doesn't quite dare to approach that in writing -- just leaves it as implied as the nature of his and John's relationship. ]
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[It seems cut and dry to him. Even if he personally feels like he's never experienced this kind of physical attraction or attachment before, he's well aware that it's normal for other people (especially adults) to.
Still, it's a complicated subject, as is Sleipnir. Seeing this is one of those rare occasions where Harold is using his name makes him instantly more attentive and nervous.]
No.
[That reaction is coming reflexively. There is no way in hell he could forgive Sleipnir. Take responsibility for his own actions? Sure, he's learned how to do that thanks to the clones and Last Order. But beyond that? Absolutely not.]
I'm not a good person like you are. I'm not capable of that.
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[ Himself included, but he's keeping this abstract, especially since he has no idea where Accelerator's own feelings on the subject lie. Somehow they've gotten into two heavy conversations at once about two totally different things... but they're both important enough that Harold won't drop one for the other.
The reflexive refusal disappoints him, makes his throat feel tight. Harold doesn't know what he's doing here, not really, doesn't know where he's found the gall to think he could help mentor a young person through topics as difficult as this--
But then another comment comes. Harold types carefully: ] Forgiveness is not a feeling but an act. One you've already shown yourself capable of.
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[Admittedly, he's a little more curious about Harold and John's relationship status than he is Jayce and Viktor. He's closer to them, and for crying out loud, they were fake-married on Earth-2. There has to be something there, even if he isn't sure what it is.
Besides that, there are his own feelings about himself. He doesn't think Harold is correct, he's just thinking the best of him. It hurts, not being able to live up to his expectations.]
You mean with you? That was different.
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[ Harold is very much the sort of person who thinks consent should be explicit and enthusiastic. Only yes means yes. And though it's vanishingly rare for Harold to speak frankly about this, he thinks Accelerator is owed some clarity on who he and John are to each other. It's a natural thing to wonder about if he's going to be living with them, unspoken arrangement or not. ]
No, I meant that you encountered him on Auriel, endured him taunting you and metaphorically "killing" you again, and restrained yourself. If forgiveness is an action then you're doing it already.
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[He isn't sure what that says about him that he was making that assumption in particular. He'd like to chalk to up to the society he was raised in without any further reflection. That's a hell of a lot easier than the alternative.]
I wasn't doing that out of any sense of fucking kindness towards him. It was a necessity for the mission. I was being pragmatic.
[And it had been a huge struggle the entire time. Part of himself still hates that he refrained from doing anything.]
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It doesn't lessen our relationship in my mind any, in case that has to be said. I've never been overly concerned with ascribing to social conventions.
Intent and outcome are wholly, mercifully separate. [ Then he has to stop and struggle with himself over what to type next, because Harold has a huge spinning array of thoughts on this topic, and he needs to distill them down rather than just go off on a lecture about one of his favorite ethical dilemmas. ]
I can't measure what you might have done or why you did it, only what you did do. It was a foundational premise to how I built the Machine. And it was vital to prevent it from being used as a tool for abuse.
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Anyways, this conversation is making it very clear that he doesn't actually know what Harold and John's relationship is. They're partners, but if one removes the physical component from that description, and take Harold's lack of interest in social conventions into account, what's left is... very vague and ambiguous.
Since they're talking about, he thinks he may as well ask. They're already starting to clear the air, there isn't any reason to stop now.]
Then what the hell are you two?
[It is, at least, a lot easier to ask that than tackle the rest of Harold's texts. This is far from the first time Harold has compared him to the Machine, and it makes him wonder what she would do if she was in this position. Which, ironically, she may have been? He doesn't know the details of her creation, but Harold has told him a few key things in the past.]
Didn't she try to kill you a bunch of times?
[He knows that whole situation must have been complicated, but he has to ask anyways.]
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I've never been troubled by the need to find a label for it. We care for one another very much.
[ There's Harold's lack of concern for social convention coming into play again. His deep appreciation of the complexity of humanity, of emotions and of morals, means he doesn't feel compelled to define things too closely. The ambiguity is where reality sits. ]
Yes, sometimes for credible reasons. I could and did terminate the Machine multiple times. It was not illogical for it to see me as a threat.
But that isn't what I was getting at. If you, like the Machine, could predict behavior to varying degrees of accuracy, what threshold would you pick for when to intervene? How confident do you need to be in your prediction to treat someone as a criminal? I had and continued to have the capacity to terminate her existence. Why did she cease seeing me as a threat?
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[It's kind of crazy to hear that. Yes, Harold is sentimental and more in touch with his emotions than he is, but he's still a logical person. You don't build the first goddamn sentient AI without having the kind of mindset that lends itself to analyzing, categorizing, formulating clear answers. And this is not that.]
That depends on what lens I'm using to judge someone with. Back home it's easy, since I'm the head of the city it's my responsibility to make sure people have the freedom and privacy to make their own choices, and when those choices are counter to fair laws I'm the one who makes sure they're prosecuted and rehabilitated in a way that allows them to learn from their mistakes and become productive members of society, and not fall through the fucking cracks.
[It's a burden, but it also provides him with a certain amount of structure and a clear direction.]
In Etraya I don't have that responsibility. It doesn't even fucking matter that I'm the #1. We don't even have a legal system to act as a yardstick for what's considered criminal, so all I have to go off of are my own experiences and emotions.
[Which is intensely frustrating! He doesn't like his emotions, he hates that they exist and he refuses to engage with them on any meaningful level as much as possible.]
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[ Harold really, truly, genuinely could not care less what other people think of his relationships. Words are communication tools, not limiters on reality. If the person in question needs more communication, he will oblige, but if there's no need for it then he doesn't see the point for its own sake. Limitations are so often just society-approved illusions.
Then he reads over the rest of this message closely, taking it in. Accelerator is usually quite terse, so he takes this as a sign that this topic touches him acutely. ]
Enforcing an established legal system is a reasonable fallback when you've just been thrust into a position of immense authority, so don't take this comment as a criticism. But as with the Machine, laws will not be adequate for who you are or who you might become. You must form your own judgment.
I'm liable to talk in circles on this concept, as it weighed on me heavily for many years, so I'll cut to the chase. Things you have almost done don't count on the moral scale. Things you might do don't count. Things you are capable of, thoughts you've had, even your feelings -- they can't ever be measured. It's like solving an equation without defining a key constant. That undefined constant remains, a ghost weighing over you casting doubt on your conclusions.
The only certainty you can have is through judging by actions alone. And I am proud of your actions.
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